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Post by jlavallee on Oct 4, 2010 12:17:07 GMT -8
thanks for some expert knowledge there Jason! No sweat, I've met enough experts to know I am far from that level, just lucky that by virtue of my work history that I've had the opportunity to learn more about the topic than many. |
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rgmrts
Committee Member 
dan
Posts: 827
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Post by rgmrts on Oct 4, 2010 13:32:10 GMT -8
so what would make my bike shift and clutch different with maxxis versus actevo
they were both MC spec
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Post by Gangplank on Oct 4, 2010 14:01:41 GMT -8
yeah. Definitely. Great info.
Trying to decide if it is worth it to stick with the full synth that he had run (Amsoil 20w-50 for HOT ASS TX) but the stuff is pretty darn expensive. The Rotella 6T is only $20 a gallon at wallmart and other stores.
I've seen a lot of chatter about people using it. No ones seems to have blown up. Some claim 30,000+ miles of street bike use.
Hmmm... stay with Activo 50/50 I run in my other bike or try Shell Rotella 6T.
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Post by jlavallee on Oct 4, 2010 14:30:28 GMT -8
so what would make my bike shift and clutch different with maxxis versus actevo they were both MC spec Just because they're both MC oils they still have different base stocks and additive packages. Should be somewhat similar but it's like baking a cake, everyone has their own recipe and priorities. Were the grades the same? |
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Post by jlavallee on Oct 4, 2010 14:36:15 GMT -8
yeah. Definitely. Great info. Trying to decide if it is worth it to stick with the full synth that he had run (Amsoil 20w-50 for HOT ASS TX) but the stuff is pretty darn expensive. The Rotella 6T is only $20 a gallon at wallmart and other stores. I've seen a lot of chatter about people using it. No ones seems to have blown up. Some claim 30,000+ miles of street bike use. Hmmm... stay with Activo 50/50 I run in my other bike or try Shell Rotella 6T. I usually buy mobil 1 bike oil from walmart at about $9/liter and it is full syn available in 10W40 and 20W50. There should be lots of synthetics in that range. You don't need to change so often that it is a big deal. Most bikes you're probably rated for 3000 miles street and I'd change at maybe 1000 miles racing. |
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Post by Justin(o) on Oct 4, 2010 14:43:37 GMT -8
Ya know what I do?
It couldn't be more simple, actually
I do what Jlavallee does solely because he does it.
Or I could sit here and pretend like we could figure out how he's wrong.
Uahuahuah!
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Post by Oneup on Oct 4, 2010 15:56:47 GMT -8
I'd change at maybe 1000 miles racing. That would save me some money. We are doing oil changes on the race bikes every 300-500 miles. |
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dub
Committee Member
Wiles
Posts: 809
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Post by dub on Oct 4, 2010 19:52:36 GMT -8
Greg, have you ever commissioned a used oil analysis? If not, I feel you especially could benefit from this service because a) you operate your motors in the harshest of environments (racing) and b) you are, due to ever increasing cost, concerned about service intervals. I've used blackstone in the past and would recommend them. www.blackstone-labs.com/gas-engine.phpedit: I think I even have a few sample mailers laying around I could give you. |
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Post by Oneup on Oct 4, 2010 20:10:19 GMT -8
I might try that. I would be interested to know how much money I'm wasting on oil. I am pretty sure that the Honda and Suzuki would be fine with greater intervals but I don't like taking that chance. Next year we will be on Yamahas and I know that they have issues. Most of the fast guys are changing their oil after every weekend to keep the motors from blowing. The R6's are screamers but they are very temperamental.
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Post by Gangplank on Oct 4, 2010 20:29:10 GMT -8
Aren't we all...
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rgmrts
Committee Member
dan
Posts: 827
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Post by rgmrts on Oct 4, 2010 20:34:59 GMT -8
so what would make my bike shift and clutch different with maxxis versus actevo they were both MC spec Just because they're both MC oils they still have different base stocks and additive packages. Should be somewhat similar but it's like baking a cake, everyone has their own recipe and priorities. Were the grades the same? Yes they were the same and I noticed the difference within the first mile |
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Post by jlavallee on Oct 5, 2010 5:47:25 GMT -8
Just because they're both MC oils they still have different base stocks and additive packages. Should be somewhat similar but it's like baking a cake, everyone has their own recipe and priorities. Were the grades the same? Yes they were the same and I noticed the difference within the first mile Yeah, I've seen that on some bikes where they don't like certain brands. Usually this is down to the way that oil is working with the clutch. That is often the complaint of non-bike oils. (I know maxxis is a "bike" oil but where do they buy it from?) I guess what I am trying to say is this... Ever heard of a Maxxis oil refinery? They and all the other off brands buy their oil from the big oil companies and then maybe they put their own additive packages into it. Buying Shell, Castrol, Mobil etc... In their MC version is your best bet. These guys have the R&D labs and testing to know what works best. I'm not saying that some little guy can't come up with a great idea or solve a problem but those companies are usually absorbed into the big guys. I love the wear tests you see on TV with the pressurized roller and it shows wear marks from the oil companies oils but add slick 50 and look, no mark at all. Anybody can make an oil pass a couple of tests but getting an oil to provide protection for moving parts, allow a clutch to grip and resist shear from tranny pressures... Big difference. That being said, all variants have some benefits and tradeoffs. If you know the typical failure of an engine you could certainly pick a formulation to help avoid those issues. |
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Post by jlavallee on Oct 5, 2010 6:18:40 GMT -8
I might try that. I would be interested to know how much money I'm wasting on oil. I am pretty sure that the Honda and Suzuki would be fine with greater intervals but I don't like taking that chance. Next year we will be on Yamahas and I know that they have issues. Most of the fast guys are changing their oil after every weekend to keep the motors from blowing. The R6's are screamers but they are very temperamental. Doing an oil analysis is the only real way to know. You need to also send a new oil sample too so you can compare. You'll be looking at viscosity, base number, acid number, water, sediments, particulate etc... What we do when sampling industrial equipment is to baseline and monitor the trends. If we have an equipment issue that we determine to be oil related like say micro pitting, we will test and evaluate. Otherwise, it is standard condition based monitoring and eventually we arrive at where we know the lubricant is breaking down. This and a factor of safety help to dictate the preventative maintenance interval. There may be oils that after 200 miles are breaking down in an R6 and some others may go 5000 miles. I can't say for sure without testing. What I can say is that whatever the manufacturer recommends for a service interval for harsh service cut by 1/3 should be easily attainable for any name brand MC oil in the manufacturer spec. My 06 R6 manual says change oil every 4000 miles for normal street use. I have no issue assuming a good oil can stand up to 1/4 of track pace before breaking down so I change somewhere prior to 1000 miles. This of course assumes I have no coolant leaks or anything else contaminating the oil. If I did oil analysis I might be able to go farther or maybe I am dangerously close now? I'm making SWAG (scientific wild ass guess) without having any data. I'd be lying if I said otherwise. |
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Post by Oneup on Oct 5, 2010 9:27:16 GMT -8
I know an 07/07 r6 used as a race bike has one of the lowest engine life expectancies of most modern sportbikes. I have never looked into the reason why but most of the top mechanics say changing oil in that bike every one or two days of use and running a little more oil than specified by the manufacturer greatly increases engine life. The 08-10 bikes are supposed to be a little better but still very temperamental.
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rgmrts
Committee Member
dan
Posts: 827
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Post by rgmrts on Oct 5, 2010 9:31:48 GMT -8
what is the life expectancy of a cbr1000rr motor 2006 not used on the track anybody know??
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